HP Forum Archive 07

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Non-Programable RPN Calculators Message #1 Posted by Matt on 4 Feb 2002, 4:59 p.m. This may seam like an unusual request. I'm looking for a non-programable RPN calculator that uses a LCD display. As read through the list of older hp's they all seam to be either RPN and non-programable with a red LED display, or programable with an LCD display. In a pintch, the red LEDs would be ok, but I'd like to avoid that if I could. Matt

Re: Non-Programable RPN Calculators Message #2 Posted by Ron Ross on 4 Feb 2002, 7:56 p.m., in response to message #1 by Matt All LCD RPN calculators are really programmable, no real exceptions. However, do to a small technicallity, the Hp17bii and Hp19bii are not considered programmable since they only provide a solver with no branching capability. Both are RPN and the 19bii also has trig functions. Else as you said, Hp made LED calcs that were non programmable, Hp32e, Hp31e, Hp21, Hp45, Hp35, Hp27. Most will cost what an Hp19bii will cost and be harder to find. Have I overlooked anything?

Re: Non-Programable RPN Calculators Message #3 Posted by John Ioannidis on 5 Feb 2002, 11:21 p.m., in response to message #2 by Ron Ross Also: hp-01, hp-10, hp-22, hp-37, hp-46, hp-70, hp-80, hp-81, hp-91, hp-92, hp-9805. I doubt you want to lug around a 9805 even if you could find it, though :-) Why do you care about non-programmability? You don't *have* to program a programmable calculator!

Re: Non-Programable RPN Calculators Message #4 Posted by Ex-PPC member on 6 Feb 2002, 5:17 a.m., in response to message #3 by John Ioannidis John wrote: "Why do you care about non-programmability? You don't *have* to program a programmable calculator!" I concur with this observation, I thought the same when I read the original post. Any programmable RPN can be used as if it wasn't at all, so what's the point ? About the only reason I can fathom for the absolute need of a non-programmable RPN calculator is if programmables are forbidden at some exam. Else, the minimal LCD programmable is possibly the HP-10C, which has only 8 bytes of program memory to begin with [they only expand to about 70 if you do key in some program]. Also, it's programmability is so minimal that most HP-25 worthwhile programs simply don't fit in. However, getting an HP-10C is much easier said than done, so the next minimally-programmable, affordable LCD model must be the HP-12C. This model has also only 8 bytes of program memory initially. If you want it for use as an everyday RPN, non-programmable calculator, I would honestly recommend using an inexpensive, easy to get HP-12C. It has lots of storage registers, it's classy and good looking, Singapore and USA models are solid and well built [unlike Chinese ones], and has all functions you would need, save trigonometrics. And if you do need trigonometrics, you can use its program memory to store a trigonometrics package permanently. It's exactly what I use, always at hand.

Re: Non-Programable RPN Calculators Message #5 Posted by Ellis Easley on 4 Feb 2002, 8:14 p.m., in response to message #1 by Matt I hadn't thought about it, but I guess you're right. Gives more perspective to the RPN vs. algebraic situation: are RPN users smarter? more demanding? are algebraic users not to be trusted? One possibility to meet your requirement is the 17BII. You can set it to RPN, and it is not programmable in the usual sense. It has a Solver that lets you store functions that operate like the Time Value of Money program, but unless you know some undocumented things, you can't use any form of looping. Mr. Maguire could shed some light on this.

Re: Non-Programable RPN Calculators -- Disable Programming? Message #6 Posted by Paul Brogger on 6 Feb 2002, 6:09 p.m., in response to message #1 by Matt I tried to disable programming on my HP-32S. I filled every variable (A-Z and i) with a many-digit number (including large exponent) and I added a few values to the statistical sum. This seemed to bring memory down from 390 bytes down to 126. Still programmable, I'm afraid. (That is, unless someone else can think of even more ways to eat up the little bit of memory offered with the 32S/SII models . . . )

Re: Non-Programable RPN Calculators -- Disable Programming? Message #7 Posted by Raymond Hellstern on 7 Feb 2002, 4:59 a.m., in response to message #6 by Paul Brogger Hi, you could even put some glue under the PRGM mode key;-) That would prevent you from 'accidently' programming the machine. But maybe this has some other drawbacks, too... More seriously: I'd take a 17B or 17BII, since those models don't have a PRGM mode key. Of course they are programmable, but in a somewhat different way... So if someone looks at a 17B at first, it obviously seems to be non-programmable. Raymond

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