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Given up on Prime (Almost)
06-02-2015, 03:58 AM
Post: #1
Given up on Prime (Almost)
I'm the one that had an HP Prime screen get washed out after upgrading to the latest firmware. HP graciously sent me a new replacement, albeit with the older firmware. Everything seemed to work fine out of the packaging and I should have been happy with that. However, I wanted to upgrade the firmware to get the Sketch feature (pretty impressive). After a "successful" upgrade many of the white keys are unresponsive (the top two three rows excluding the enter key, and the alpha and shift key don't register). Looks like another call to HP. So far I'm impressed but very disappointed. Not sure what to think about the calculator or the upgrading, or both.

Since the shift key doesn't work there is no way to turn it off or reset it (besides the button on the back, which does nothing.) Hmmm. Thought HP had a competitive product, but I'm seriously rethinking it.

C
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06-02-2015, 07:48 AM
Post: #2
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
I had almost the same issue. It was a replacement direcly from HP headquartes in Colorado, but some keys didn´t work. Fortunately in a week it came the new replacement (to Spain, fantastic service with Fedex). Now this unit works flawless.
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06-02-2015, 08:32 AM
Post: #3
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
I had a similar experience with the HP 30b - roughly half of those I bought had faulty keyboards, all very quickly replaced with correctly working models.

Still - Quality control seems absent.
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06-02-2015, 02:24 PM
Post: #4
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
Time to mix both primes into one Smile at least this model has screws instead of plastic rivet

My website: erwin.ried.cl
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06-02-2015, 02:27 PM
Post: #5
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-02-2015 08:32 AM)Gerald H Wrote:  I had a similar experience with the HP 30b - roughly half of those I bought had faulty keyboards, all very quickly replaced with correctly working models.

Still - Quality control seems absent.

I also "had similar experience", not only with HP-calcs, but through smart other toys. For the last 15 years my TI-83plus, TI-92, HP-50G (one from a couple) and HP-39gii all broke ranks after completion of term of guarantee. The greatest loss for me is a loss of data and spent time, but not cost of this Chinese garbage. I do not know now, which platform to choose for future calculations to the next 10 years: HP-Prime or TI-Nspire CAS? FX-2.0 and HP-50G remain my best calculators for all times so far.
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06-02-2015, 04:14 PM
Post: #6
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
Casio ALGEBRA FX 2.0 PLUS is a very nicely constructed calculator, suffering from the traditional Casio style operating system defects, chiefly non-integration.
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06-02-2015, 05:02 PM (This post was last modified: 06-02-2015 05:09 PM by AnalogJoe.)
Post: #7
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
I'd stay away from the Casios, the scientifics are fine, but the more advanced calculators are not worth it, if you have the time , look at this video on youtube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmdudS30OBI

Its a lengthy review and demonstration of the main Graphing calculators out there, the Casio Class Pad is a complete piece of junk.

Youll find out that the HP Prime beats hands down all the calculators in the market. Im sorry you've had so many problems with your Prime, but the Prime IS the best calculator out there. The TI Inspire doesnt come close to the processing power, speed and ease of use of the HP Prime, the Prime with its touch screen is one of a kind, I mean the Casio Class Pad uses a stylus for crying out loud, its like 1998 all over again.

Now if you are still decided on ditching the HP Prime, then I suggest getting an HP 50G, it doesnt have near the same graphing power as the Prime, and its less friendly to use, however it will perform most of what you probably need, eventhou the Prime is overall a better calculator, I still prefer the 50G, a lot of things are easier to do on the 50G, and it includes several features that the Prime lacks, such as an equation library, symbolic Fourier Transform and FFT (the Prime only has FFT), and so on....

And again given that today if you really need specialized apps and heavy calculation capability you would probably would use something like Matlab, I guess theres a point up to when the calculator stops being the correct tool for the job, so given what I just mentioned, I think both the Prime and 50G are great, but if I had to choose between both of them, I would choose the 50G even if the Prime is overall a better calculator.
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06-02-2015, 05:07 PM
Post: #8
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-02-2015 05:02 PM)AnalogJoe Wrote:  symbolic Fourier Transform and FFT (the Prime only has FFT), and so on....

Could you elaborate a bit on that?

TW

Although I work for the HP calculator group, the views and opinions I post here are my own.
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06-02-2015, 06:27 PM
Post: #9
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
I came to this personal classification, just my humble opinion:

• FX CP400 for school
• 50g for engineers
• Paper clip for Prime.
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06-02-2015, 07:53 PM
Post: #10
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
As Tim Wessman wrote about HP-39gii:
http://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-276...24126.html
"...1) The company that makes the chip (Sigmatel) was purchased by another (Freescale) for the IP alone essentially. Within a few weeks everyone involved with the chip in question had left for greener pastures. We were 4/5 of the way through the project and suddenly there was no support or anyone who could provide information to us. ..."
No sadder story in the world... What prospects at the project under the name of "HP-Prime"? It would be desirable to see the better display and support of SD cards, or as a last resort trouble-free functioning of the hardware.
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06-03-2015, 08:09 PM (This post was last modified: 06-03-2015 08:28 PM by debrouxl.)
Post: #11
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
Quote:FX CP400 for school
Ouch. IMO, the fx-CP400 is a terrible choice, for school or otherwise:
* it's barely an improvement in functionality over the CP-300/330 from a decade older - that is, the OS barely takes advantage of the color screen's abilities;
* it's a closed platform, like the TI-Nspire series... but far fewer people are interested in opening it;
* on TI-Planet, it was shown multiple times to be extremely slow for a subset of algorithms relevant to high schoolers. The majority of algorithms runs acceptably fast on the fx-CP400, but execution of multiple simple algorithms has been shown to reproducably take up to 400s (!), which is two orders of magnitude slower than all of the TI-Z80 series, the TI-68k series, the TI-Nspire series, Casio Prizm (fx-CG10/20), HP Prime.
Changing mode from auto/exact to approx reduces the insane fx-CP400 timings on those programs, but calculators running '1970s Z80 processors, and far less RAM (not that the fx-CP400 has a decent amount thereof, compared to the Nspire and Prime), still trounce the fx-CP400 in approx mode.
* adding insult to injury, the fx-CP400 is extremely expensive for end users. Teacher special offers are more affordable - but that's natural, low price is the only way Casio can get people to buy that stinker.

I've heard about BASIC slowness of the CP-300/330 over a decade ago, and these calculators were expensive... the fx-CP400 is just the same, with the gimmick of a large color touch screen.


Needless to say, all other models have their share of defects.
The Prime has a number of unpolished areas and defects, even if Tim, Cyrille and others are hard at work on reducing them. It keeps crashing sooner or later after transferring or executing nontrivial PPL programs (above several hundreds of KBs), for instance. Too bad it has only 32 MB of RAM.
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06-03-2015, 09:40 PM
Post: #12
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-03-2015 08:09 PM)debrouxl Wrote:  transferring or executing nontrivial PPL programs (above several hundreds of KBs), for instance. Too bad it has only 32 MB of RAM.

Would be nice to get some examples of those "non-trivial" programs...

TW

Although I work for the HP calculator group, the views and opinions I post here are my own.
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06-04-2015, 06:47 AM
Post: #13
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-02-2015 06:27 PM)Tugdual Wrote:  I came to this personal classification, just my humble opinion:

• FX CP400 for school
• 50g for engineers
• Paper clip for Prime.

Anybody, please explain me the meaning of the statement "paper clip for Prime". Is it a local slang?

(06-02-2015 05:02 PM)AnalogJoe Wrote:  ... I think both the Prime and 50G are great, but if I had to choose between both of them, I would choose the 50G even if the Prime is overall a better calculator.

Internally the feeling prompts to me that it is necessary to buy one more HP-50.
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06-04-2015, 06:47 AM (This post was last modified: 06-04-2015 06:48 AM by debrouxl.)
Post: #14
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
Quote:Would be nice to get some examples of those "non-trivial" programs...
Well, AFAICT from critor's tests, such programs aren't on short supply from mViewer GX Creator.
Transfer compression reduced raised the trouble spot, but didn't eliminate it.

Your TI-Planet account "timwessman" was specially marked Premium since pretty much the beginning, so you have full access to mViewer GX Creator, including making archives private so that tests don't clutter the list, and slightly higher-priority conversions Smile
After registration, accounts of Cyrille or other HP folks can be upgraded on request.
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06-04-2015, 07:11 AM
Post: #15
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-04-2015 06:47 AM)Hlib Wrote:  Anybody, please explain me the meaning of the statement "paper clip for Prime". Is it a local slang?
Nope, not slang, that means you'll have extensive use for RESET button.
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06-04-2015, 07:13 AM
Post: #16
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-03-2015 08:09 PM)debrouxl Wrote:  
Quote:FX CP400 for school
Ouch. IMO, the fx-CP400 is a terrible choice, for school or otherwise:
* it's barely an improvement in functionality over the CP-300/330 from a decade older - that is, the OS barely takes advantage of the color screen's abilities;
* it's a closed platform, like the TI-Nspire series... but far fewer people are interested in opening it;
* on TI-Planet, it was shown multiple times to be extremely slow for a subset of algorithms relevant to high schoolers. The majority of algorithms runs acceptably fast on the fx-CP400, but execution of multiple simple algorithms has been shown to reproducably take up to 400s (!), which is two orders of magnitude slower than all of the TI-Z80 series, the TI-68k series, the TI-Nspire series, Casio Prizm (fx-CG10/20), HP Prime.
Changing mode from auto/exact to approx reduces the insane fx-CP400 timings on those programs, but calculators running '1970s Z80 processors, and far less RAM (not that the fx-CP400 has a decent amount thereof, compared to the Nspire and Prime), still trounce the fx-CP400 in approx mode.
* adding insult to injury, the fx-CP400 is extremely expensive for end users. Teacher special offers are more affordable - but that's natural, low price is the only way Casio can get people to buy that stinker.

I've heard about BASIC slowness of the CP-300/330 over a decade ago, and these calculators were expensive... the fx-CP400 is just the same, with the gimmick of a large color touch screen.


Needless to say, all other models have their share of defects.
The Prime has a number of unpolished areas and defects, even if Tim, Cyrille and others are hard at work on reducing them. It keeps crashing sooner or later after transferring or executing nontrivial PPL programs (above several hundreds of KBs), for instance. Too bad it has only 32 MB of RAM.
Thanks for your input. I don't own one, just played with the emulator which I found quite convincing to say the less. CAS is very effective and the whole interface pretty efficient but I'm glad you did put my comment in perspective with a "real life" experience.
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06-04-2015, 08:18 AM
Post: #17
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-04-2015 07:11 AM)Tugdual Wrote:  
(06-04-2015 06:47 AM)Hlib Wrote:  Anybody, please explain me the meaning of the statement "paper clip for Prime". Is it a local slang?
Nope, not slang, that means you'll have extensive use for RESET button.

I think the latest firmware brought quite a few improvements and crash occurrences have decreased considerably.
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06-04-2015, 10:05 AM
Post: #18
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-04-2015 08:18 AM)Marcio Wrote:  
(06-04-2015 07:11 AM)Tugdual Wrote:  Nope, not slang, that means you'll have extensive use for RESET button.

I think the latest firmware brought quite a few improvements and crash occurrences have decreased considerably.
I hope so. Last time I used the Prime, the function scroll feature with "inertia" had just been added. Problem is that inertia was totally bricking the Prime after 4 taps and Tim said I shouldn't remove the finger from screen while scrolling. This is when I crossed the line and went for a 50g.
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06-04-2015, 10:56 AM
Post: #19
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-04-2015 08:18 AM)Marcio Wrote:  Tim said I shouldn't remove the finger from screen while scrolling. This is when I crossed the line and went for a 50g.

Maybe you were using the wrong finger ...
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06-04-2015, 11:09 AM
Post: #20
RE: Given up on Prime (Almost)
(06-04-2015 10:56 AM)DrD Wrote:  
(06-04-2015 08:18 AM)Marcio Wrote:  Tim said I shouldn't remove the finger from screen while scrolling. This is when I crossed the line and went for a 50g.

Maybe you were using the wrong finger ...
I ended up with the middle one for sure Big Grin
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