LOGO/TURTLE/TORTUGA MODE on HP Prime Graphing Calculator
10-27-2018, 02:20 PM (This post was last modified: 11-03-2018 04:51 PM by compsystems.)
Post: #1
 compsystems Senior Member Posts: 1,202 Joined: Dec 2013
LOGO/TURTLE/TORTUGA MODE on HP Prime Graphing Calculator
Hello, Users and Developer group of the famous hp-prime calculator
Sorry for my technical english.

I think the greatest success of the introduction of a child or young person in the world of computational thinking is the simple graphic manipulation, like the logo/turtle, since it gives "life" to the output or response of an algorithm, instead of just displaying "boring" text.
I think it would be a good complement to HPPRIME to incorporate the LOGO mode app, so children can "paint" drawings with simple instructions

The Numworks calculator has already taken the first step
NumWorks https://github.com/numworks/epsilon/pull/748

PHP Code:
from turtle import *  def spiral(N_iteration):  N_iteration *= 25  for i in range(N_iteration):  # Change pen color  gray=255-(i*255/N_iteration)  pencolor(int(gray),int(gray*0.75),int(gray*0.25))  # Draw a segment of the spiral  forward(i*0.1)  left(10

PHP Code:
from turtle import *  def koch(N_iteration):  # Save pencil size and set it to 1  prevSize = pensize()  pensize(1)  # Define inner function for recursion  def _koch(n, l):  if n == 1:  forward(l)  else:  _koch(n-1,l/3)  left(60)  _koch(n-1,l/3)  right(120)  _koch(n-1,l/3)  left(60)  _koch(n-1,l/3)  # Call inner function  _koch(N_iteration,140)  # Restore pencil size  pensize(prevSize)

Source Forum> https://tiplanet.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=102&t=21922

is already incorporated in xcas. (see pag 15)
https://www-fourier.ujf-grenoble.fr/~par...vie_en.pdf

Tourtle frn info by Thomas Rey Source http://casedesmaths.net/images/pour_tous/xcas.pdf

Tortue Pour ceux qui ne connaissent pas, la tortue graphique faisait partie du langage de programmation Logo créé à la ﬁn des années 1960. Il s’agit en fait d’une « pointe de crayon » à qui on donne des ordres simples du style, avance de 10 unités, tourne de 45°à droite, change de couleur, . . .
Un module tortue est présent dans Xcas, on y accède en cliquent sur le menu Tortue. On obtient alors une fenêtre qui ressemble à la ﬁgure 6 (ci-jointe)

On peut écrire dans les lignes de saisie (à gauche de la ﬁgure) des instructions simples par exemple avance(30) ou tourne droite(60), . . . et la tortue exécute les ordres ; dans le même temps, les instructions sont recopiées dans la fenêtre de programmation (à droite).
On peut alors compléter par des boucles, des tests, comme dans le module Prog
L’ensemble des ordres possibles est accessible facilement sous la fenêtre graphique par un code à deux lettres av pour avance, re pour recule, . . . (la description s’aﬃche en « info-bulle » lorsqu’on survole le bouton à l’aide de la souris)

Par exemple, pour tracer un carré un programme possible est le suivant (à saisir à droite)

PHP Code:
pour k de 1 jusque 4 faire    avance(30);    tourne_droite(90); fpour;

On l’exécute en cliquant dans le menu Edit sur Exec all. Le carré se trace.
Autre exemple qui donne la ﬁgure 7 (ci-jointe).
PHP Code:
efface(); // Efface l’ écran    etapes :=36; // nombre de cercles "intérieurs"    p :=20; // longueur d’un côté du polygone à étapes côtés   h:=0.5*p/(tan(pi/etapes)); // rayon d’ un cercle intérieur    pas de cote 10; // pour centrer la fig    saute 60;  // idem   pour k de 1 jusque etapes faire // boucle   crayon irem(k ,5); // choix de la couleur du crayon   tourne gauche(360/etapes);// construction d’un côté   avance(p/2);  // suite   rond(h); // trace un cerclefpour ; // fin de boucle

to eng

LO SUFICIENTEMENTE BUENO ES ENEMIGO DE LA EXCELENCIA.
10-27-2018, 04:32 PM
Post: #2
 Tim Wessman Senior Member Posts: 2,209 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime

You do know this is "programmable" don't you?

There is more then just CAS functions. You don't seem to have discovered anything but that yet...

TW

Although I work for the HP calculator group, the views and opinions I post here are my own.
10-27-2018, 05:04 PM
Post: #3
 cdmackay Senior Member Posts: 443 Joined: Sep 2018
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
Ironically, Bernard Parisse's version of Xcas for the Casio FX CG-50 — Khicas — does include the turtle program.

Cambridge, UK
41CL/DM41X 12/15C/16C DM15/16 71B 17B/BII/bII+ 28S 42S/DM42 48GX 50g 35s 30b/WP34S Prime G2
& Casios, Rockwell 18R :)
10-27-2018, 06:56 PM
Post: #4
 parisse Senior Member Posts: 1,051 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
Indeed, it's gaining in popularity here in France as a transition between Scratch and Python(-like) programming. Xcas turtle commands would be straightforward to port on the Prime, but interface would require some work and it would probably be easier to implement independantly from the CAS, because in the Xcas implementation computation and drawing are done in 2 independant steps, which is much more complicated than required on a calculator (this limits the number of turtle instructions to 512 on the Casio Prizm because of the memory available).
10-27-2018, 09:52 PM
Post: #5
 CyberAngel Member Posts: 231 Joined: Jul 2018
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
(10-27-2018 06:56 PM)parisse Wrote:  Indeed, it's gaining in popularity here in France as a transition between Scratch and Python(-like) programming. Xcas turtle commands would be straightforward to port on the Prime, but interface would require some work and it would probably be easier to implement independantly from the CAS, because in the Xcas implementation computation and drawing are done in 2 independant steps, which is much more complicated than required on a calculator (this limits the number of turtle instructions to 512 on the Casio Prizm because of the memory available).

Application, anyone?
10-28-2018, 03:12 PM
Post: #6
 Jean-Baptiste Boric Member Posts: 50 Joined: Jan 2016
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
Original author here. Like Tim said, the HP Prime's programming language can easily support a user turtle implementation without needing the HP's team help to do it, as long as someone writes it. While I'm here, I'll point out that (if I recall correctly) the official MicroPython port of the Casio 90+E can't currently do graphics and neither does the not-yet-released external Python module for the TI-83 Premium CE.

For the NumWorks, I'm going for a native implementation because that calculator's Python environment is a bit cramped for a "nice" turtle. It should make a nice surprise for my nephew next time he plays with my calculator.
10-28-2018, 04:11 PM
Post: #7
 eried Senior Member Posts: 739 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
(10-27-2018 04:32 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote:  Make your own.

You do know this is "programmable" don't you?

There is more then just CAS functions. You don't seem to have discovered anything but that yet...

But Tim, what about adding turtle to the Prime, while reducing ram usage and getting more free flash space?

Also, a new CAS simple deep-learning algorithm could be used to predict if the user does not want these and remove it, freeing more space

My website: erwin.ried.cl
10-28-2018, 04:55 PM
Post: #8
 CyberAngel Member Posts: 231 Joined: Jul 2018
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
(10-28-2018 04:51 PM)compsystems Wrote:  According to my experience in the teaching of basic computer science for secondary and tertiary students, who have practically no knowledge of computer language (Colombia is an underdeveloped country, just emerged from a conflict after 50 years of war), requires educational technology backed for with good didactic units. I think that the hp-prime Xcas is a great CAS and device, although a bit complicated, the first thing is that you should coficate yourself as close as possible to the mathematical language, in addition to the programming alternatives like logo/turtle pre-included, the applications of Third parties, discourage the beginner, who has little experience in the installation, configuration, loading and removal of applications.
I emphasized the key word
It's up to the teacher/educational system.

what is the word "coficate"? (underlined)
10-28-2018, 07:01 PM (This post was last modified: 10-28-2018 07:02 PM by toml_12953.)
Post: #9
 toml_12953 Senior Member Posts: 1,305 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
(10-28-2018 04:55 PM)CyberAngel Wrote:
(10-28-2018 04:51 PM)compsystems Wrote:  According to my experience in the teaching of basic computer science for secondary and tertiary students, who have practically no knowledge of computer language (Colombia is an underdeveloped country, just emerged from a conflict after 50 years of war), requires educational technology backed for with good didactic units. I think that the hp-prime Xcas is a great CAS and device, although a bit complicated, the first thing is that you should coficate yourself as close as possible to the mathematical language, in addition to the programming alternatives like logo/turtle pre-included, the applications of Third parties, discourage the beginner, who has little experience in the installation, configuration, loading and removal of applications.
I emphasized the key word
It's up to the teacher/educational system.

what is the word "coficate"? (underlined)

Maybe it's from the same lexical root as "covfefe"

Tom L
I'm pining for the Fjords
10-29-2018, 12:17 AM
Post: #10
 CyberAngel Member Posts: 231 Joined: Jul 2018
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
(10-29-2018 12:12 AM)compsystems Wrote:  X
Autre exemple
Another example. – That I understood...
10-29-2018, 01:55 AM
Post: #11
 jonese Junior Member Posts: 20 Joined: Jun 2018
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
Everything old is new again.

I remember using LOGO in Elementary school (~1982) on a Apple ][ plus.
10-30-2018, 01:17 PM (This post was last modified: 10-30-2018 01:21 PM by Tim Wessman.)
Post: #12
 Tim Wessman Senior Member Posts: 2,209 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
It would also mean every single one of the many commands would appear EVERYWHERE and be commands everywhere, no matter if relevant or not.

This would be a few days at work for an end user to create a much better version more fit for Prime. It is a good thing we created a PROGRAMMABLE graphing calculator, huh?

TW

Although I work for the HP calculator group, the views and opinions I post here are my own.
10-30-2018, 02:26 PM
Post: #13
 CyberAngel Member Posts: 231 Joined: Jul 2018
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
(10-30-2018 01:17 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote:  It would also mean every single one of the many commands would appear EVERYWHERE and be commands everywhere, no matter if relevant or not.

This would be a few days at work for an end user to create a much better version more fit for Prime. It is a good thing we created a PROGRAMMABLE graphing calculator, huh?

Turtle ! okay
but
Lambert W,....fully implemented?
10-30-2018, 02:36 PM (This post was last modified: 11-01-2018 11:53 AM by compsystems.)
Post: #14
 compsystems Senior Member Posts: 1,202 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE MODE on hpPrime
Numworks was the first calculator to implement python language, then ti83 through external hardware, although XCAS admits that python syntax is not the same as python, python is the language that is approaching the number 1 language in the world.

LO SUFICIENTEMENTE BUENO ES ENEMIGO DE LA EXCELENCIA.
10-30-2018, 02:53 PM
Post: #15
 Tim Wessman Senior Member Posts: 2,209 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE/TORTUGA MODE on hpPrime
Remind me when they begin to catch up to everything else...

In the meantime, I look forward to seeing your published software you are working on.

TW

Although I work for the HP calculator group, the views and opinions I post here are my own.
11-03-2018, 02:04 PM
Post: #16
 compsystems Senior Member Posts: 1,202 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: LOGO/TURTLE/TORTUGA MODE on HP Prime Graphing Calculator
Hello, In the github.com forum

Quote:wow, definitely something we need to merge! Thank you very much for this awesome contribution @boricj ! We'll try to review this as soon as possible

The French development team of the famous numWorks calculator will incorporate this great contribution. I hope that more enthusiasts are incorporated to advance in the development of calculators to improve mathematics education, since it has a high degree of desertion throughout the world. It is because the mathematical language is formal and not natural, while the natural language (English, Spanish, etc.) are languages of survival, that of mathematics is not. At least not for the common people.

LO SUFICIENTEMENTE BUENO ES ENEMIGO DE LA EXCELENCIA.
 « Next Oldest | Next Newest »

User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)