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HP Forum Archive 17

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My Brief Comments on 35S as shown
Message #1 Posted by bill platt on 5 June 2007, 9:18 p.m.

1. The cursor keys use a lot of real estate, yet have only single shifts--apparently to menus. Why not put blue-shifts on them?

2. If MODE is used merely for switching RPN and ALG, it is a big waste of direct keys.

3. Neither LN nor e^x are primary. This really aught to be rectified. Both should be there in my opinion. Of course we have precedents that vary: 41c with both LOG and LN primary, shift for exponents, and the 11c, which was exactly opposite, and finally the 32sii which is as I suggest.

4. It is rather interesting to see "i" as a primary key. In the past, on all the models I have used, I and i or (i) have always been shifted and it really hasn't been a problem. Furthermore, it appears that all the indirect addressing is using either a primary key or a shifted function. On the 32sii, these were actually quaternary functions--they didn't even use up a shift! Here on the 35s, only the (i) and (j) appear to be quaternary.

5. Similarly, the SPACE was always a quaternary. If the letters are quaternary, why can't the space be--shared with R/S--as it was on the 32sii. When writing an equation or a note, R/S is meaningless anyway, so it is a good use. Heck, even the 41c did this after a fashion.

6. Moving the Equation List as well as brackets, to primary keys seems good to me--it opens up the equation feature to prominence, rather than an apparent buried add-on (which it was) on the 332sii.

7. I do hope the the equation list is fully editable with those cursors. It sure better have all the functionality of the 17bii in that respect--being able to edit rather than backspace over an equation. Indeed, it would be nice if they implemented the softkeys of the 17bii equations, but I would bet that is not going to be the case. Just as long as you can edit the equations though--that would be a big improvement. [Perhaps it would be difficult to implement softkeys, when the equations are valid both on their own as well as in programs. The parser would have to understand to disable softkeys when in programs.

Another wish-list item for equations would be the ability to copy equations for editing, and also the ability to pull equations that are in the List into RPN programs, though both of these features start to sound like RPL features don't they?

8. For additional primary key real estate, GTO could be shifted if need be. We accepted it as such on the 32sii, even though it is used for navigation as well as programming.

Edited: 5 June 2007, 10:25 p.m.

Re: My Brief Comments on 35S as shown
Message #2 Posted by Chuck on 5 June 2007, 11:20 p.m.,
in response to message #1 by bill platt

I had some similar thoughts about the wasted spaces with resoect to a few functions. For instance

(1) the square root is shifted requiring 2 key strokes. This can be done by 2 x^y, also two strokes, (and also, ENTER *, again two strokes, but not as useful in a program).

(2) the x-root option shouldn't be necessary for anyone using a scientific. Radicals, bah! 7th root is just 7 1/x x^y. No need for a dedicated x-root button.

OT. I played around with a TI-36 that was left in my class today. A lot of neat features on this little guy. A few of them I'd like to see incorporated into the 35s (I still don't like any TI's). TI 36X

Re: My Brief Comments on 35S as shown
Message #3 Posted by ECL on 6 June 2007, 12:38 a.m.,
in response to message #2 by Chuck


I've been having recurring thoughts along those lines.

In fact, I don't recall ever using the y, x, root(y,x) key. I always key in coefficient, exponent, 1/x, y^x.

I do this for everything on my 33s, including squaring a number. I laughingly approached it as an experiment that caught on. As you pointed out, y^2 is just a common case of the y^x. So it can only reduce efficiency to keep track of two special cases (y^2, y^3) when running numbers. I am, however, very happy for the return of the x^2 and root(x) sharing the same key.

When using my 32sii, I became so fluent with keystrokes that I consciously evaluated the "form" of my motions, feeling an affinity for certain fluidity.

To illustrate: Square the number 5

1. Index finger (5)

2. Thumb (shift)

3. Middle finger (x^2)

With a fluid rhythm. It was a bit of a dance or art to smoothly navigate nested expressions.

Keyboard quality with the 49g and *+ really struck close to home. The 50g is a solid step in the return of HP, and if the actual 35s product follows the cues of the pre-release pictures, while improving/maintaining the 33s & 50g keyboard qualities, we'll have something nice to look forward to.


Re: My Brief Comments on 35S as shown
Message #4 Posted by Walter B on 6 June 2007, 1:27 a.m.,
in response to message #1 by bill platt

Hi Bill,

agree with most of your comments. To add, I suspect "i" to be used for complex number input and indirect addressing. However, there's little space left for primary functions like LN and e^x.

Please look at this link. I'm most willing to take proposals for blue-shifted cursor functions. Your comments, please :-)

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