The Museum of HP Calculators

HP Forum Archive 16

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HP 32SII prices
Message #1 Posted by Jan on 17 May 2006, 3:23 p.m.

Hi,

Could anybody explain me why the 32SII is so mindblowing expensive on the 2nd hand market. It is usually even more expensive now than the price for a new unit when it was still in production. I mean, there are dozens of disconnected HP models that go for much lower prices, even units from the beloved 41 series usually do. I owe a 32SII that I bought ten years ago when my 15C was (temporarely) nowhere to be found in my new home after I had moved in (it was found later). I never considered the 32SII a very special calculator, although it is very usefull and it has quite some power. What is actually the idea behind the high prices nowadays?

regards Jan

      
Re: HP 32SII prices
Message #2 Posted by Bram on 17 May 2006, 5:09 p.m.,
in response to message #1 by Jan

Quote:
I never considered the 32SII a very special calculator

I think it is. I have the feeling that at the time of the 32S and 32SII HP was struggling how to keep the increasing power of the calculators manageable. At some stage you have to use tricks to access all the power with a limited number of keys. The 32S had menu's that hided more or less a lot of functions, the 32SII put many of them back on the keyboard. Perhaps a messy appearance, but most of them were there and menu's were used for grouping things like flags and tests. May be the 32SII is the most powerful calculator with which you don't have to carry a manual as well.

According to the prices it MUST be a very special calculator ;-)

      
Re: HP 32SII prices
Message #3 Posted by Karl Schneider on 17 May 2006, 10:24 p.m.,
in response to message #1 by Jan

Jan --

I speak from similar experience, having bought a new HP-15C in late 1983 and using it through three degree programs. I bought a new HP-32SII in 2002 after learning in this forum that they were about to be discontinued. I use the HP-32SII at work, keeping a few useful programs in memory. I also have the HP-42S and a PC with Matlab for my use.

Bram's comments were accurate about the 32SII having more features, but a less-organized appearance than the HP-32S, which categorized most functions into menus. Most users preferred having functions readily accessible and printed on the keyboard, rather than having to think which menu it resided under.

The Pioneer-series units do not have beveled-face keys that provide a space for a second shifted function. Hence, menus were programmed for the alphanumeric-capable models with dot-matrix displays. Until the HP-32SII, only the 7-segment (thus menu-less) HP-20S and HP-21S had two shifted functions per key, with the legends printed side-by-side on the faceplate. This does not look as neat and organized as the Voyager-series (e.g., HP-15C), HP-41, and HP-71B, with legends centered on and above each key. (The HP-15C is an absolute marvel of thoughtful functional organization -- one never has to hunt for anything, despite the abundance of functions.)

So, why is the HP-32SII so expensive today? Because many other people, myself included, find it a better-engineered device than the HP-33S, mainly for the design and legibility of the display and keyboard. "Attention to detail" was apparent in other aspects of the HP-32SII, and let's not even discuss the mathematical bugs in the original versions of the HP-33S that were not present in the HP-32SII or any other "genuine HP" calculator, for that matter.

Quite frankly, I would have been more pleased if HP/Kinpo had simply provided the HP-32SII with at least 2 kB of RAM and had restored the original brown-bezel face with yellow-and-blue shift keys. Perhaps the obsolescence of certain manufacturing technology precluded such an approach. I, for one, have little use for the weird keyboard, two-line display, ALG mode, x3, and x1/3 of the HP-33S.

-- KS

Edited: 18 May 2006, 11:02 p.m.

      
Re: HP 32SII prices
Message #4 Posted by E.YOUNG on 18 May 2006, 10:37 a.m.,
in response to message #1 by Jan

If you need just a plain number cruncher without advanced programing I think the 32sii is very hard to beat. I have used one for almost my entire career as a structural engineer, and find it to be extremely useful and easy to use. What I have valued is the ability to enter equations, RPN, the solid engineering of the earlier units when the numbers were molded into the keys. The 33s is more capable only because you can enter more programs into it, but the 32sii is better designed. I also like that most of the functions are on the keyboard so that you don't have to go through a bunch of menus. Also, I love its ability to use fractions. In my line of work, I frequently encounter them. I can only compare it to the 11c of the voayager series, but I also like how the 32sii compares in speed, especially when using trig functions.

I consider the 32sii to be almost perfect, all it needed was some more memory. However, it seems to me based on observing this forum that models like the 41 series are more popular with those who are into electrical engineering or electronics. What the 32sii did not need was a weird color scheme and keyboard layout. It still boggles my mind that HP went to the color scheme and chevron layout of the 33s.

            
Re: HP 32SII prices
Message #5 Posted by Antonio Maschio (Italy) on 18 May 2006, 11:57 a.m.,
in response to message #4 by E.YOUNG

I totally agree with you (I'm a civil engineer too), and my 32SII beats up the 33S, even if 32SII memory was not that much...

-- Antonio

                  
Re: HP 32SII prices
Message #6 Posted by e.young on 18 May 2006, 1:17 p.m.,
in response to message #5 by Antonio Maschio (Italy)

do you find the fractions capabilty helpful? Probably not because you use SI units. When I bought my first 32sii I was amazed that it could handle fractions.

                        
Re: HP 32SII prices
Message #7 Posted by Dia C. Tran on 22 May 2006, 2:27 p.m.,
in response to message #6 by e.young

I never liked the 32SII nor the 42S but after seeing the price of the 42S shot up at discontinuation I bought the 32SII for $50 just to have one. I never really used it.

                        
Re: HP 32SII fractions
Message #8 Posted by Karl Schneider on 22 May 2006, 9:53 p.m.,
in response to message #6 by e.young

"e.young" --

I, also, was very impressed at the ability of the HP-32SII to calculate with fractions. It is quite capable and versatile in that, even after converting the closest decimal equivalent of an entered fraction, it will quickly find the closest-approximation fraction (reduced to lowest terms if desired) to a decimal value within the denominator limits. I've wanted to know the method, because to store each and every equivalent would take a lot of ROM. The method might be continued fractions, according to this old archived post:

http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/archv007.cgi?read=13348#13348

The link to the document about continued fractions in the old post is dead, but now the document resides here:

http://www.library.cornell.edu/nr/bookcpdf.html

The feature is unique to the HP-32SII and HP-33S. The earliest HP-32SII's (1991) had a bug in the fractions functionality.

I've written (but not posted) several short programs utilizing the functionality to convert between fractional inches and millimeters, in order to find the closest match to a given metric or British-unit wrench.

-- KS

Edited: 22 May 2006, 9:59 p.m.

                              
Re: HP 32SII fractions
Message #9 Posted by e.young on 23 May 2006, 1:19 p.m.,
in response to message #8 by Karl Schneider

karl, what was the bug? My daily use machine was made in '93.

                                    
Re: HP 32SII fraction bug from 1991?
Message #10 Posted by Karl Schneider on 23 May 2006, 10:07 p.m.,
in response to message #9 by e.young

Quote:
karl, what was the bug? My daily use machine was made in '93.

Alas, I don't know, but I'm sure that yours includes a fix.

I briefly owned a 1993 HP-32SII, purchased from eBay. When I took delivery, I noted that the display unit was faulty, and the seller took it back for refund. He also had a 1991 HP-32SII, and I advised him that there was a fraction bug in it, which he confirmed.

He sold both units on eBay (after repairing the one I had).

-- KS

                                    
Re: HP 32SII fractions
Message #11 Posted by John Smitherman on 23 May 2006, 11:17 p.m.,
in response to message #9 by e.young

e., see the description toward the bottom of this link:

http://www.finseth.com/hpdata/hp32sii.html

I hope that this helps,

John

                                          
Re: HP 32SII fraction bug from 1991?
Message #12 Posted by Britt on 24 May 2006, 10:49 a.m.,
in response to message #11 by John Smitherman

My main (and all-around favorite) calculator is a 1991 (I think) Singapore HP-32Sii with serial number 3145S05129.

I does *not* exhibit the fraction bugs described in http://www.finseth.com/hpdata/hp32sii.html

Britt


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