newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
01-21-2018, 11:30 PM
Post: #121
 tcab Junior Member Posts: 19 Joined: Dec 2017
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(12-23-2017 10:16 AM)pier4r Wrote:
(12-23-2017 06:49 AM)BarryMead Wrote:  I have a question about the "Desktop" windows version of newRPL. I downloaded the 1001 version and installed it on my Windows 7 partition, and it does indeed come up on the screen. I can type some numbers on the numpad and Enter, and operators like * + - /, but when I try to use the mouse to click on the graphical representation of the HP-50G keyboard next to the display window nothing happens.

As far as I remember, they should not "click". I use the real pc keyboard (of which the mapping is not yet well documented but it is ok).

In practice you have the commands reachable by letter (for example pressing 'y' is like pressing '1/x' unless alpha is activated and then 'y' shows) Then you have the numbers that are like 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,0 on the keyboard. The dot is dot. Space is space. Enter is enter. *,-,+ should be equal on the keyboard (I do not remember correctly) while division is 'z'.

alpha, right and left shift should be shift, ctrl, tab or a combination of those.

Unfortunately the newrpl desktop version now does not run anymore on XP so I cannot test on my thinclient and I am lazy to open win10pro.

I tried running the PC simulator and also found that the image of the HP50G keyboard seems to be a non functional decoration. The only keys that initially seemed to work were 0-9 and *+-/ ENTER. Since I cannot find any documentation on how to use the emulator, and can't find a wiki, (not referred to on http://hpgcc3.org/projects/newrpl), I experimented and here is what I found.

O enters ''
TAB enters alpha mode
CAPSLOCK left shift
CTRL right shift
S SIN() and CAPLOCK S GIVES ASIN()
DELETE drops 1

After that it gets confusing. hitting 'd' key emits 'a', hitting 'f' makes some menu change, but I don't know how to select from that menu. 'q' key emits '^' the 'w' emits + or - alternately (its different every time). 'r' emit square root, 't' emits '()'. 'Y' emits INV and 'u' emits TAN().'p' and 'd' make a menu appear but again, not sure how to select operations.

How do I enter << and { and [ ?
Can I enter programs and edit them in the PC simulator? Is there a simple example/tutorial for doing this?
What is the PC simulator for newRPL meant for - can I use it like a 50G with all the features or just for some limited features, or just running RPL?
Post: #122
 BarryMead Senior Member Posts: 399 Joined: Feb 2014
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-21-2018 11:30 PM)tcab Wrote:  How do I enter << and { and [ ?
Can I enter programs and edit them in the PC simulator? Is there a simple example/tutorial for doing this?
What is the PC simulator for newRPL meant for - can I use it like a 50G with all the features or just for some limited features, or just running RPL?
You are right that the graphical image is purely informative, but use it as a reference as to what the alphabetic keys do. For example the "R" key will take the square root of the number on the stack. If you press "Caps Lock" then "R" it will do X squared, or if you press "Ctrl" then "R" it will take the X'th root of the number in Y, where X is the number in stack level 1 and Y is the number in stack level 2. Etc.
Once you get used to it, it is pretty easy. As for the double arrow brackets "<< >>" you press the "Ctrl" key then the Plus key "+" on your keyboard. The curly braces {} are accessed by pressing "Caps Lock" and Plus "+". After you figure out how to decipher the graphical image it turns out to be a pretty useful reference. Also note that the "Alpha" mode takes a bit of getting used to. Use the "Tab" key to cycle through the three way Alpha modes. The first press of "Tab" puts you into "UPPER CASE" alpha mode, the second press of "Tab" puts you into "lower case" alpha mode, and the third press of "Tab" turns alpha mode off again. I hope that someday they add mouse support for clicking on the keys directly like most other desktop simulators, but for now it DOES have utility and even though it is a bit clumsy I have grown quite fond of the Emulator myself.
01-22-2018, 11:11 AM (This post was last modified: 01-22-2018 11:16 AM by Gilles59.)
Post: #123
 Gilles59 Member Posts: 136 Joined: Jan 2017
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
I tried the USB connexion between the simulator my PC and my HP50g.

Very easy to install : nothing to do and to use. But i've a problem : I can easily SEND very small objects from the PC to the HP50g. But i'm unable to send objects more than few bytes. The simulator returns 1 on the stack (send OK), but I get nothing on HP50g.

Is this a known problem ?

For exemple, i'm unable to transfert the NewRPL program http://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-9962.html
from the simulator to the HP50g
01-22-2018, 12:20 PM
Post: #124
 BarryMead Senior Member Posts: 399 Joined: Feb 2014
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-22-2018 11:11 AM)Gilles59 Wrote:  For exemple, i'm unable to transfert the NewRPL program http://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-9962.html
from the simulator to the HP50g
Have you tried loading the program into the emulator and using "20 USBRESTORE" on the 50G and "USBARCHIVE" on the emulator?
01-22-2018, 10:41 PM
Post: #125
 Gilles59 Member Posts: 136 Joined: Jan 2017
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
Hi, Bug report :

Code:
{ 1 2 3 {} 5 } {} POS

Expected : 4
Crash simulator (v1001), unexpected result with the HP50g (v1001)
01-22-2018, 10:49 PM
Post: #126
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-22-2018 11:11 AM)Gilles59 Wrote:  I tried the USB connexion between the simulator my PC and my HP50g.

Very easy to install : nothing to do and to use. But i've a problem : I can easily SEND very small objects from the PC to the HP50g. But i'm unable to send objects more than few bytes. The simulator returns 1 on the stack (send OK), but I get nothing on HP50g.

Is this a known problem ?

For exemple, i'm unable to transfert the NewRPL program http://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-9962.html
from the simulator to the HP50g

That's not normal. Most of my testings were transferring lists with 10000 integers (generated with a simple FOR loop). at 4 bytes per integer, it was a roughly 40 kbyte transfer with no issues back and forth (automatic ping-pong).
Now I just updated my build environment to latest Ubuntu updates, latest Qt, also updated VirtualBox to latest version and did notice a couple of problems with USB. I can transfer the first object without a hitch, but then the entire USB stack in Linux crashes (??), and the kernel shuts down the USB subsystem. I'm not sure if this is a regression in VirtualBox, Linux, or a bug that was always there and now became apparent.
I need to investigate further, first test I'd do is to try it on real hardware to discard VirtualBox problems. What's your configuration? Running directly on Windows?
01-22-2018, 10:50 PM (This post was last modified: 01-22-2018 10:53 PM by Gilles59.)
Post: #127
 Gilles59 Member Posts: 136 Joined: Jan 2017
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-22-2018 11:11 AM)Gilles59 Wrote:  For exemple, i'm unable to transfert the NewRPL program http://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-9962.html
from the simulator to the HP50g
Have you tried loading the program into the emulator and using "20 USBRESTORE" on the 50G and "USBARCHIVE" on the emulator?

No, I tried the USBSEND command.

"ABCD" USBSEND is OK
but it dont work with a larger object

What I trie is, on the simulator :

'MyProgram' RCL USBSEND

EDIT : To Claudio : Yes , Its windows10
01-22-2018, 10:52 PM
Post: #128
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-22-2018 10:41 PM)Gilles59 Wrote:  Hi, Bug report :

Code:
{ 1 2 3 {} 5 } {} POS

Expected : 4
Crash simulator (v1001), unexpected result with the HP50g (v1001)

Confirmed, thanks for the report. I'll investigate and fix.
01-22-2018, 11:19 PM (This post was last modified: 01-22-2018 11:31 PM by Claudio L..)
Post: #129
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-22-2018 10:50 PM)Gilles59 Wrote:  No, I tried the USBSEND command.

"ABCD" USBSEND is OK
but it dont work with a larger object

What I trie is, on the simulator :

'MyProgram' RCL USBSEND

EDIT : To Claudio : Yes , Its windows10

Sorry if it seems obvious, but did you run something like
10 USBRECV
on the receiving side?
Otherwise your program will be immediately executed, likely ending with some error, which perhaps vanished before you looked, making it seem like nothing happened.

After restarting my VM, I cannot reproduce any errors, it seems USB is running well, so I spoke too soon, can't find anything wrong with it.
EDIT: Further testing, I can send your program from that thread in ping-pong style without any problems, that doesn't discard there could be some timing problems on your hardware, but that would be extremely difficult to debug without me having your PC.
01-23-2018, 12:52 PM
Post: #130
 Gilles59 Member Posts: 136 Joined: Jan 2017
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-22-2018 11:19 PM)Claudio L. Wrote:
(01-22-2018 10:50 PM)Gilles59 Wrote:  No, I tried the USBSEND command.

"ABCD" USBSEND is OK
but it dont work with a larger object

What I trie is, on the simulator :

'MyProgram' RCL USBSEND

EDIT : To Claudio : Yes , Its windows10

Sorry if it seems obvious, but did you run something like
10 USBRECV
on the receiving side?

No... ;D
I just connect the HP50G, click in the simultor do init the connexion.
If I just do "Hello" USBSEND, I get this on first level of the stack in the HP50g.

I will read the doc in this forum or the wiki try again ;D.
01-23-2018, 05:14 PM
Post: #131
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-23-2018 12:52 PM)Gilles59 Wrote:
(01-22-2018 11:19 PM)Claudio L. Wrote:  Sorry if it seems obvious, but did you run something like
10 USBRECV
on the receiving side?

No... ;D
I just connect the HP50G, click in the simultor do init the connexion.
If I just do "Hello" USBSEND, I get this on first level of the stack in the HP50g.

I will read the doc in this forum or the wiki try again ;D.

That's good news, then there's no problem with your USB connection.
Basically the receiving side will "autoreceive" which includes executing whatever programs you send automatically (for remote control). You can disable it by setting flag -47. When you do, you'll see "RX" on the status area whenever an object is available, which you can receive "manually" using USBRECV.
Be aware that the selection dialog uses the remote control to retrieve the newRPL build number and verify the device is responding, so you need to clear flag -47 in order for the calculator to be recognized in that dialog box.
Now I find more useful to run USBRECV first on the receiving side (which will NOT execute anything automatically), then send it with confidence (without messing with flags). Another trick is to put the program on a list, then you need to extract it from the list on the receiving side, but won't be executed.
If you really don't want to touch your receiving side, then you can send a program to do a remote-controlled-manual-receive (if that makes any sense):
Code:
«   «     10 USBRECV DROP    »   USBSEND DROP    DO USBSEND UNTIL END »

You can call this program SENDOBJ, will send an object without executing it.
01-25-2018, 08:06 PM (This post was last modified: 01-28-2018 02:25 PM by compsystems.)
Post: #132
 compsystems Senior Member Posts: 837 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
Idea:

Show on history view only the level + 1, that is, if not objects in the stack, then display 1:

if there are three objects, display 1: to 4:

I do not see the need to fill the whole screen with numbers

http://www.hpcalc.org 20 years online
01-30-2018, 10:49 PM
Post: #133
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-25-2018 08:06 PM)compsystems Wrote:  Idea:

Show on history view only the level + 1, that is, if not objects in the stack, then display 1:

if there are three objects, display 1: to 4:

I do not see the need to fill the whole screen with numbers

I made the change. I don't necessarily like the look but it is faster not to draw the numbers so I don't object.
I also implemented your suggestion to show the pixel grid. It's disabled by default but can be activated from the menu. I personally prefer not to show the grid.

Those who build their own simulator can test it immediately, others will have to wait until the next release.
01-31-2018, 02:46 PM
Post: #134
 The Shadow Member Posts: 119 Joined: Jan 2014
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
Claudio,

Just curious where library objects are in the road map? I've got enough programs now that they would be nice to have.
01-31-2018, 03:05 PM
Post: #135
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-31-2018 02:46 PM)The Shadow Wrote:  Claudio,

Just curious where library objects are in the road map? I've got enough programs now that they would be nice to have.

I'd say solvers are needed first, then forms (GUI, plotting, etc.), then libraries. Libraries in RPL is a challenging subject so it's more interesting to me than plotting, for example. So I'm open to change the order here to libraries, then solvers, then forms. Anyone disagree?
01-31-2018, 03:20 PM
Post: #136
 The Shadow Member Posts: 119 Joined: Jan 2014
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(01-31-2018 03:05 PM)Claudio L. Wrote:
(01-31-2018 02:46 PM)The Shadow Wrote:  Claudio,

Just curious where library objects are in the road map? I've got enough programs now that they would be nice to have.

I'd say solvers are needed first, then forms (GUI, plotting, etc.), then libraries. Libraries in RPL is a challenging subject so it's more interesting to me than plotting, for example. So I'm open to change the order here to libraries, then solvers, then forms. Anyone disagree?

I have to admit that all those things are needed. I'd say stick with your plan.
01-31-2018, 04:12 PM
Post: #137
 pier4r Senior Member Posts: 1,241 Joined: Nov 2014
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
Claudio if you find libraries more engaging and it could result in fun mode for you, go for it. You are using your free time, you can use it as you whish.

Also libraries allows the community to expand while you do the rest.

Wikis are great, Contribute :)
02-17-2018, 09:55 AM
Post: #138
 pier4r Senior Member Posts: 1,241 Joined: Nov 2014
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
Claudio, still alive?

Wikis are great, Contribute :)
02-18-2018, 04:10 AM
Post: #139
 Claudio L. Senior Member Posts: 1,195 Joined: Dec 2013
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(02-17-2018 09:55 AM)pier4r Wrote:  Claudio, still alive?

Alive and kicking. I'm a few days away from releasing the user libraries module, just giving the final touches to the LIBS menu.
02-18-2018, 11:30 AM
Post: #140
 martinot Junior Member Posts: 33 Joined: Aug 2017
RE: newRPL - build 1001 released! [update:build 1016]
(02-18-2018 04:10 AM)Claudio L. Wrote:
(02-17-2018 09:55 AM)pier4r Wrote:  Claudio, still alive?

Alive and kicking. I'm a few days away from releasing the user libraries module, just giving the final touches to the LIBS menu.

Great!

How well does newRPL work on HP 39gs? As well as 50g (besides ROM size)?

The 50g is so expensive these days, and you can get many 39gs for a decent price.

HP 35s, HP 50g, HP Elite X3, SwissMicros DM42
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