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Theoretically - could this work?
06-18-2015, 05:34 AM
Post: #1
Theoretically - could this work?
I have a Digital LVP16 pen plotter. It communicates via RS-232-C and uses HP-GL.
I have an HP-82164A Hp-IL/RS-232C interface, an HP-41CX with IL and Plotter modules.

For some reason I feel like banging my head against the wall, inspired by trying to get three devices to talk to each other using RS-232.

Anyone know if there is a reason this will not work? I don't mind trying to get these things to talk to each other, but if you know of a brick wall in my way please pipe up.
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06-18-2015, 08:53 AM
Post: #2
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
It should work. I've used both the 41 and the 71 a lot with the HPIL-to-RS232 interface converter, or actually an FSI164 which is like an HP82164A but has a minimum of two RS-232 channels, optionally up to 8, and had a battery-powered option also. Otherwise it's almost completely the same. HPGL is just text, and with the HPIL and XIO modules I have no doubt you can do everything you need to. You might not even need the XIO, but mine is merged in a double module, and I tend to forget which functions are not part of the HPIL module. If you don't want the plotter, you could donate it to me! Big Grin

http://WilsonMinesCo.com (Lots of HP-41 links at the bottom of the links page, http://wilsonminesco.com/links.html )
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06-18-2015, 11:55 AM (This post was last modified: 06-19-2015 10:39 AM by Sylvain Cote.)
Post: #3
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Have you tried to use it in manual mode ?
Code:
MANIO     (Manual I/O)
1         (device position in the loop, your RS-232C interface)
SELECT    (select the device)

optional: clear MAN/NORM/TRACE printer flags
Code:
CF 15
CF 16

test GP-GL command
Code:
PINIT     (create Plotter module I/O buffers and should select the first pen)
0
PEN       (plotter select the pen 0 = release pen)
PCLBUF    (clear Plotter module I/O buffers)

edit: test HP-GL command sequence
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06-18-2015, 01:44 PM
Post: #4
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Not that far yet, I am going to check the serial cable I have tonight to confirm wiring between the devices. I also need to power up the plotter and run the self test to see if it still works, its been years. I have some pens, still in foil packages, I hope I have enough to fill the pen carousel. I have not seen these for sale in ages.

I used it to make maps using Generic CAD in the previous century. I miss watching a pen plotter create a drawing.
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06-18-2015, 04:14 PM
Post: #5
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
(06-18-2015 01:44 PM)4ster Wrote:  I used it to make maps using Generic CAD in the previous century. I miss watching a pen plotter create a drawing.

I know what you mean! There's something about seeing the printhead zip around in all directions that's more fun than seeing our DesignJet print with a printhead that just goes back and forth. I also like one that only moves one pen at a time and has to return to a holding station to automatically swap pens.

Tom L
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06-18-2015, 08:46 PM
Post: #6
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Code:
There's something about seeing the printhead zip around in all directions
I doubt that it will be "zipping around" with a 41 controlling it Big Grin ; but sometimes speed is of secondary importance.

http://WilsonMinesCo.com (Lots of HP-41 links at the bottom of the links page, http://wilsonminesco.com/links.html )
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06-19-2015, 01:43 AM
Post: #7
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
(06-18-2015 08:46 PM)Garth Wilson Wrote:  
Code:
There's something about seeing the printhead zip around in all directions
I doubt that it will be "zipping around" with a 41 controlling it Big Grin ; but sometimes speed is of secondary importance.

I agree with you Garth.
Plotting with the standard HP-41 on the HP-7470A is an exercise of patience.
But you should see it fly with a 41CL running at 50x the speed. Amazing!
I will make a video this weekend showing the difference and will post back the link here after.
Sylvain
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06-19-2015, 01:59 AM
Post: #8
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
That will be great to see. I never had the plotter module, so that should be good to see perform too.

http://WilsonMinesCo.com (Lots of HP-41 links at the bottom of the links page, http://wilsonminesco.com/links.html )
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06-19-2015, 03:56 AM (This post was last modified: 06-19-2015 04:06 AM by Sylvain Cote.)
Post: #9
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
He! He! Sooner than expected! Smile

HP 41CX plotting a sinus on a HP-7470A Plotter.
Info: 41CX HN @ 1x speed Video: ~2m45s

41CL plotting a sinus on a HP-7470A Plotter.
Info: 41CL v3 @ 50x speed Video: ~1m

The plot result is here

Equipment:
- HP-41CX and 41CLv3
- HP-82184A Plotter Module
- HP-82160A HP-IL interface
- HP-82169A HP-IL/HP-IB Interface
- HP-7470A HP-IB Plotter

edit 1: typo
edit 2: add plot result
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06-19-2015, 07:56 AM
Post: #10
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Very nice!!
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06-19-2015, 12:17 PM
Post: #11
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
(06-19-2015 07:56 AM)Ángel Martin Wrote:  Very nice!!

Thanks Ángel and also for the previous nice words Smile

FYI: I should be able this week end to take the images of the SMI ROM's that I have
and I will post a message in the appropriate thread when it's available.
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06-19-2015, 01:59 PM
Post: #12
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Thanks for posting the video. I don't think there is a better demonstration of how slow a stock HP-41 is by modern standards.

I'm afraid I will not be able to emulate the video. I tried to run the self test on my plotter yesterday and it failed to print the demonstration plot.

If it was an HP plotter I am sure that it would have started right up. However, the drive rollers would have been goo and would need the O ring hack. ;-)

Thanks all for the info.
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06-20-2015, 12:03 AM
Post: #13
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
(06-19-2015 03:56 AM)Sylvain Cote Wrote:  He! He! Sooner than expected! Smile

Very cool videos Sylvain, thanks for taking the time to make and share them, and also they're a great demo of what the 41C family was capable of doing 30+ years ago. It's also quite a testament to the quality of HP equipment of that era. I am comfortable predicting most HP InkJet printers sold today will not last 1/6 or 1/7th as long.

--Bob Prosperi
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06-21-2015, 12:55 AM
Post: #14
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
(06-19-2015 01:59 PM)4ster Wrote:  I don't think there is a better demonstration of how slow a stock HP-41 is by modern standards.

I have multiple copies of all the 8216X HP-IL peripherals and some esoteric ones.
I will make more videos in the coming weeks showing how the different peripherals works with the HP-41CX/41CL/71B/75C controllers.
I will need to buy a tripod stand and a iPhone holder for the stand if I do not want the video to be shaky as it is right now.

(06-19-2015 01:59 PM)4ster Wrote:  However, the drive rollers would have been goo and would need the O ring hack. ;-)

That's right but it cost me 2$ to buy a long replacement tube of the right circumference.
I then upgraded my two 7470A plotters and have enough left to upgrade several others.
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06-26-2015, 05:17 AM
Post: #15
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Well, I am back up and running. I found a HP 7475A on ebay for a decent price since it was missing the pen carousel. It turns out that my original Digital plotter is a rebranded 7475A so it has become my parts machine. The new plotter ran the demo plot perfectly. I was amazed that only one of the pens had dried out after sitting in the carousel for so long.

Now the hair pulling starts.
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07-14-2015, 01:19 PM (This post was last modified: 07-14-2015 01:20 PM by 4ster.)
Post: #16
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
Still have about half my hair. When its all gone I hope to be able to post a video of the HP-41 plotting quantity of hair vs. time spent with the HP-IL RS232.
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07-14-2015, 11:26 PM
Post: #17
RE: Theoretically - could this work?
(07-14-2015 01:19 PM)4ster Wrote:  Still have about half my hair. When its all gone I hope to be able to post a video of the HP-41 plotting quantity of hair vs. time spent with the HP-IL RS232.
Certainly an exponential curve. Or is that a Log curve... I always use to get those messed up.

--Bob Prosperi
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