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Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
07-29-2014, 08:55 PM
Post: #1
Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
Some Library 4 questions for the 41CL. I ask some of these questions in case future people might have the same questions.

1) 4AOS is the older AMC-OSX Library 4 rom, correct? It seems the OSX3 is the good, current bank-switched Library 4 rom image that “should” be used.

2) The PLUGP function on the 41CL plugs a rom image into page 6 aka the Printer ROM page. The 41CL manual indicates Hepax and PowerCL as the only rom images that “play nice” at that location. Question: Is that the PWRL image or the PWRX image? Speaking of PWRX (Power CL Extreme), I can’t find documentation for that anywhere. Is it located online and if so where? Does PWRX play nice at page 6 or just PWRL?

3) The SM33 rom image is two pages, each of which is bank-switched and also Library 4 required. SM33 in alpha and PLUG2 would work and put both bank-switched pages into the system, correct? (assuming Library 4 is already there of course).

4) Same question for 4ADV. It is two bank-switched pages and so 4ADV in alpha and PLUG3 would work?

5) The rom image 4MTI is matrix and polynomial rom for Library 4 aware situations. The 41CL manual revision date for 4MTI is 12/15/12, while the Lib-4 Adv Matrix rom 4ADV revision date is 1/25/13. 4ADV is not a revision of 4MTI, correct? These are separate roms, not an update?

In a Library 4 situation, JMTX is obsolete and so is MTRA and MTRX, correct?

6) I also have my eyes open for some docs for the FSSY rom? Big Smile

7) Not a Lib 4 question, but does anyone have info on the Spreadsheet rom? SHTZ?
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07-30-2014, 06:17 PM
Post: #2
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
Ok, I think I have answered a couple of these myself.

PowerCL_B4+ is the module name that is the Library 4 aware PowerCL ROM. It works at page 6 location (PLUGP on the 41CL). What I don't know is whether this is called the PowerCL Extreme in the 41CL rom listing or not. Is the PowerCL_B4+ called PWRX or PWRL on the 41CL rom listings?

And,

The OSX3 rom (that's the 4 letter name on the 41CL) is the AMC_OS/X Module Revision 4L or higher. This is the bank-switched Library 4 aware version.

The functions in each of these two roms do not appear to duplicate each other.

Manuals for both can be found at TOS.

I think what I have said is correct.
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07-30-2014, 11:54 PM
Post: #3
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
Would like to se Angel's take on these questions... Angel, you there?
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07-31-2014, 02:32 AM
Post: #4
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
Angel :-) there is also a set of programs in the AMC/OSX Lib 4 manual called MMCOPY and MMSWAP that are just crying out to be put into a ROM image and loaded into an empty rom slot on the 41CL. If these were in a rom image and placed into flash, then it would be built-into the 41CL to have multiple copies of the 41CL ram operating environment.

Hint? Help? :-)
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07-31-2014, 04:22 AM
Post: #5
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
(07-31-2014 02:32 AM)Gene Wrote:  Angel :-) there is also a set of programs in the AMC/OSX Lib 4 manual called MMCOPY and MMSWAP that are just crying out to be put into a ROM image and loaded into an empty rom slot on the 41CL. If these were in a rom image and placed into flash, then it would be built-into the 41CL to have multiple copies of the 41CL ram operating environment.

Hint? Help? :-)

Hmm... I can't find any mention of these in the latest AMC/OSX manual. Do they deal with the MMU programming? I recall that Geoff Quickfall did something like this early on. If my memory is correct, then you should look at the 41CL Extreme Functions. They support four different MMU configurations, an active configuration, plus three alternate configurations. There are commands to STO, RCL and EX between the configurations. They work in conjunction with the MMU Lock status so that you can have static MMU programming for selected pages if you want.
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07-31-2014, 11:33 AM
Post: #6
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
They are on page 35 of the OSX3 manual. They are variations on Geoff's approach. I'll take a look at the Extreme functions.
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08-10-2014, 05:56 PM
Post: #7
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
And a couple more questions:

1) Is there any documentation for OSX3 ?

2) Any documentation for 4UTL ?

:-)

(07-29-2014 08:55 PM)Gene Wrote:  Some Library 4 questions for the 41CL.
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08-11-2014, 11:20 AM
Post: #8
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
hi guys, sorry I didn't see this thread before - I totally identify the CL with the 41 so tend to forget it's not from hp...

To respond to the several questions above:

1. Here's the list of page-6 compatible modules (obviously besides the printer and the HEPAX): AMC_OS/X; POWER_CL; and POWRCL_EX.

2. The OS/X3 is the definitive version of the AMC_OS/X. Revisions 4M and 4N are available. Latest Manual is available at TOS, but not at Monte's site - which only has one for the predecessor Revision 4L. The CL id# for the OS/X3 is -not surprisingly - OSX3, located at 0x168/9/A

3. The Power_CL is to be used with YFNP. Manual is available at TOS for revision 4M, and at Monte's site for revision 4L.

4. The POWRCL_EX is to be used with YFNX. Basically the same functionallity with slightly different U/I to take advantage of the prompting versions of PLUG, TURBO, BAUD, etc. There's no manual for it as of yet.

5. The MMCOPY and MMSWAP are not to be confused with the flash backup utilities YWALL and YRALL included in the PowerCL (and Extreme). The MM here stands for Main Memory, so the copy/swap is performed into the CL ram memory space as opposed to flash. It's done using PEEKR/POKER and not CL Y-functions, that's why they were included as examples in the OS/X manual. Gene's suggestion is excellent (as usual - but not always :-) I'll see to put them into a dedicated ROM image for convenient usage. Unfortunately won't be on another bank within OS/X, being FOCAL programs.

6. There are several versions for the SandMath and the SandMatrix scattered on the CL library. The definitive ones are SM33 and 4MTI respectively.

7. The "SpreadSheet" and "Basic & Word" modules are simple transcriptions of the user library's programs, where I've added a few others to round up the list. The original UPL# are posted at TOS/

8. The "FOCAL ASSY" pac comes from the 41 swapdisk - Be aware that I've made lots of assumptions, as I have no manual or any assurance that it'll function as intended - that material is very undocumented... also being FOCAL-based you can imagine it's no rival to the DavisAssembler or the HEPAX' HEXEDIT counterparts, so it's more of a curiosity than having any real use of course.

I may have missed some, let me know if this clarifies anyway.

Cheers,
ÁM
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08-11-2014, 11:21 AM
Post: #9
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
(08-10-2014 05:56 PM)Gene Wrote:  And a couple more questions:

1) Is there any documentation for OSX3 ?

2) Any documentation for 4UTL ?

:-)

Yes, both are posted at TOS... also one for the RAMPAGE is available there.

Cheers
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08-11-2014, 11:38 AM
Post: #10
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
(08-10-2014 05:56 PM)Gene Wrote:  And a couple more questions:


4) Same question for 4ADV. It is two bank-switched pages and so 4ADV in alpha and PLUG3 would work?

5) The rom image 4MTI is matrix and polynomial rom for Library 4 aware situations. The 41CL manual revision date for 4MTI is 12/15/12, while the Lib-4 Adv Matrix rom 4ADV revision date is 1/25/13. 4ADV is not a revision of 4MTI, correct? These are separate roms, not an update?

In a Library 4 situation, JMTX is obsolete and so is MTRA and MTRX, correct?

:-)
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08-11-2014, 02:43 PM (This post was last modified: 08-11-2014 03:03 PM by Ángel Martin.)
Post: #11
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
I knew I shouldn't have written that many modules, - it sure ain't a good deed that remains unpunished... ;-)

There's a chart in the SandMatrix Manual, page#8 (paragraph titled “The many names of Dr. Who”) that summarizes all revisions , but let's get to the bottom of things\;, here's the scoop:

1. in a Library #4 scenario (the recommended setup), the definitive (ultimate) matrix module is 4MTI. It supersedes previous revisions like 4SM4, 4MTR, 4PLY, and 4ADV.

2. In a non-Library#4 scenario I think (hard to remember anymore) the latest revision was MADV - which replaced ALGY, and MTRX.

3. MTRA was an exact duplicate with MADV - same modules with different id#'s, a glitch in the library. Feel free to overwrite one of them as you see fit.

3. JMTX is totally independent from all the above - it's a self-contained module that doesn't use the CCD/ADVtg matrix functions at all.

PS. See the attached pdf file with the complete CL flash chart...


Attached File(s)
.pdf  mem_map_AM_V2.pdf (Size: 125.52 KB / Downloads: 13)
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08-11-2014, 07:55 PM
Post: #12
RE: Library 4 rom questions - 41CL related
I'm wondering if a column should be added to the 41CL memory reference section for each rom to indicate if it has been updated / obsoleted by a newer version. That might be helpful.
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