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HP Forum Archive 20

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HP41/71b Formatted Media
Message #1 Posted by Gerry Schultz on 26 Aug 2011, 3:30 p.m.

I have the HP 82161A tape drive and an HP 9114B floppy drive. Now I know that a standard 41 can fully format a tape but only partially format a floppy. A 71b can fully format both a tape and a floppy, so if I format a floppy using the 71b, can I store HP 41 files on it and am I restricted to the first 141K or can I use the full 720K disk?

I read in the "HP-IL Files: Where, What, Why, How, etc." article on this website: "The Swap Tape program evolved into a "Swap Disk" program, where the same thing would happen using disks for media instead of tape. A single disk would contain programs for the HP-41, HP-75, and HP-71."

How did that work? (I hope there's no partitioning involved!:))

Gerry

Edited: 26 Aug 2011, 3:31 p.m.

      
Re: HP41/71b Formatted Media
Message #2 Posted by gene wright on 26 Aug 2011, 3:33 p.m.,
in response to message #1 by Gerry Schultz

I believe the limitation is in the HP IL commands in the 41 module.

To access space beyond the 128K, you need the EXT IL rom by SKWID. It allows full access to the disk after it is formatted with his new NEWM command.

That is a very rare module, but the image is included in the wonderful HP 41CL (woohoo).

Another good reason to get one.

            
Re: HP41/71b Formatted Media
Message #3 Posted by Gerry Schultz on 26 Aug 2011, 3:39 p.m.,
in response to message #2 by gene wright

I'm on the waiting list and I just bought a full-nut 41C to be the recipient of the new donor board. I am waiting!

            
(deleted post)
Message #4 Posted by deleted on 26 Aug 2011, 3:41 p.m.,
in response to message #2 by gene wright

This Message was deleted. This empty message preserves the threading when a post with followup(s) is deleted. If all followups have been removed, the original poster may delete this post again to make this placeholder disappear.

                  
Email me through the forum contact
Message #5 Posted by gene wright on 26 Aug 2011, 4:11 p.m.,
in response to message #4 by deleted

thanks

            
Re: HP41/71b Formatted Media
Message #6 Posted by Gerson W. Barbosa on 26 Aug 2011, 4:00 p.m.,
in response to message #2 by gene wright

From USING YOUR DISC DRIVE - Supplement to manual P/N dated August 1, 1984, page 12:

"Series 40/9114 Utility

The Series 40 calculators can access 130 kbytes of the HP-9114A's

630 kbytes. The following utility, when entered into a Series 40,

allows you to access the full 630 kbytes. The utility requires that

the 82183A Extended I/O Module be installed in your calculator.

Additionally, this utility is available from the User's Library (#41-

09114) on 3 1/2-inch media".

                  
Re: HP41/71b Formatted Media
Message #7 Posted by Raymond Del Tondo on 26 Aug 2011, 5:04 p.m.,
in response to message #6 by Gerson W. Barbosa

Yes, you can use lower level functions from the X I/O . However the X IL (or the X IL+) is much more user-oriented.
The X IL (+) offer enhanced versions of the most commonly used functions for storing/recalling mass media content, and much more.

      
Re: HP41/71b Formatted Media
Message #8 Posted by Howard Owen on 26 Aug 2011, 7:39 p.m.,
in response to message #1 by Gerry Schultz

Many LIF types can freely coexist on a LIF formatted disk. Whether the host OS can make sense of them depends on whether the specific types are supported. But regardless, modulo the size limitations, each machine ought to be able to pick out its native file formats from the menagerie.

Here's some Perl code I wrote that lists the numeric LIF types together with names derived from Tony's.

# $Id: LIFtypes.ph,v 1.1.1.1 2011/04/11 19:37:34 hbo Exp $
# Based on Tony Duell's lif_dir_utils.c
our $LIFtypesByNum = {
		  1          => "TEXT",
		  0xE0D1 + 0 => "STEXT",
		  0xE0D0 + 0 => "SDATA",
		  0xE0F0 + 0 => "DATA71",
		  0xE0F1 + 0 => "SDATA71",
		  0xE204 + 0 => "BIN71",
		  0xE205 + 0 => "SBIN71",
		  0xE206 + 0 => "PBIN71",
		  0xE207 + 0 => "SPBIN71",
		  0xE208 + 0 => "LEX71",
		  0xE209 + 0 => "SLEX71",
		  0xE20C + 0 => "KEY71",
		  0xE20D + 0 => "SKEY71",
		  0xE214 + 0 => "BASIC71",
		  0xE215 + 0 => "SBASIC71",
		  0xE216 + 0 => "PBASIC71",
		  0xE217 + 0 => "SPBASIC71",
		  0xE218 + 0 => "FORTH71",
		  0xE219 + 0 => "SFORTH71",
		  0xE21A + 0 => "PFORTH71",
		  0xE21B + 0 => "SPFORTH71",
		  0xE040 + 0 => "WALL41",
		  0xE050 + 0 => "KEY41",
		  0xE060 + 0 => "STAT41",
		  0xE070 + 0 => "ROM41",
		  0xE080 + 0 => "PROG41",
		  0xE052 + 0 => "TEXT75",
		  0xE053 + 0 => "APPT75",
		  0xE089 + 0 => "LEX75",
		  0xE08A + 0 => "VCALC75",
		  0xE0FE + 0 => "BASIC75?",
		  0xE088 + 0 => "BASIC75",
		  0xE08B + 0 => "ROM75",
		 };

These are types I'm aware of from just the 75C, 71B and 41C machines. The HP-85 can share LIF images up to a point. So can the Hp9000/200 and 300 machines. (I forget the details, but those machines have some incompatible extensions to LIF, but can read the older disks.)

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