HP Forum Archive 20

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HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #1 Posted by Jeff on 28 Feb 2011, 1:07 p.m. It was couple of years ago that HP announced a new financial calculator and some ugly home office units. Not much has happened since. Doesn't anyone know if they plan of releasing some new products soon? I'd say it's about time.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #2 Posted by Thomas Radtke on 28 Feb 2011, 1:51 p.m., in response to message #1 by Jeff Quote: Doesn't anyone know if they plan of releasing some new products soon? A 35s w/o the known bugs? Or are you talking about a new calcuator with new bugs, erm, sorry ... easter eggs? Yeah, it's abut time for this one ;-).

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #3 Posted by Walter B on 28 Feb 2011, 2:50 p.m., in response to message #2 by Thomas Radtke Let's see: HP has 4 types of small housings: 12C, 17bii+ Silver, 30b, and 35s. It's up to them to put something reasonable in :-) ... no, not another financial calculator :-( Ceterum censeo: HP, launch a 43S!

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #4 Posted by Jim Yohe on 28 Feb 2011, 4:04 p.m., in response to message #3 by Walter B Amen!

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #5 Posted by Eric Smith on 28 Feb 2011, 2:36 p.m., in response to message #1 by Jeff This topic comes up frequently, and the answer is always the same. Those who know don't speak, and those who speak don't know. -- Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #6 Posted by Martin Pinckney on 28 Feb 2011, 2:54 p.m., in response to message #5 by Eric Smith Quote: Those who know don't speak [TW], and those who speak don't know [et al.] Edited: 28 Feb 2011, 5:59 p.m. after one or more responses were posted

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #7 Posted by Eric Smith on 28 Feb 2011, 3:01 p.m., in response to message #6 by Martin Pinckney There are probably more than a dozen people in the "those who know don't speak" category, but I'm not one of them. It's a shame that we don't have the HHC conference twice a year. I'm just about ready to attend another one. :-)

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #8 Posted by gene wright on 28 Feb 2011, 4:51 p.m., in response to message #7 by Eric Smith HHC 2011 is just around the corner. Personally, I'm hoping for quite a bit of activity around the 41CL between its release (soon?) and HHC 2011. :-)

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #9 Posted by BruceH on 28 Feb 2011, 4:59 p.m., in response to message #8 by gene wright Quote: HHC 2011 is just around the corner. Yes. Especially as it is going to be held in school holiday season so the education folks can attend. :-p Edited: 28 Feb 2011, 5:00 p.m.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #10 Posted by Eric Smith on 28 Feb 2011, 8:56 p.m., in response to message #9 by BruceH It's not in mid-September this year?

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #11 Posted by Jake Schwartz on 1 Mar 2011, 5:02 p.m., in response to message #10 by Eric Smith Quote: It's not in mid-September this year? It is at HP in San Diego on 24-25 September. Jake

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #12 Posted by Eric Smith on 1 Mar 2011, 9:14 p.m., in response to message #11 by Jake Schwartz Hmmm. That doesn't sound like "school holiday season" to me. Does school start in October in the UK?

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #13 Posted by Namir on 2 Mar 2011, 3:39 a.m., in response to message #11 by Jake Schwartz Jake, Are these dates and the location solid??? Namir

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #14 Posted by gene wright on 2 Mar 2011, 7:31 a.m., in response to message #13 by Namir They will be soon. Final details are being locked down.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #15 Posted by Katie Wasserman on 2 Mar 2011, 10:47 a.m., in response to message #14 by gene wright Gene, What happened to your hometown as an HHC venue? From the November 2010 HP Solve: Quote: The most popular proposed location for HHC 2011 is Nashville Tennessee -Katie

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #16 Posted by Namir on 2 Mar 2011, 2:00 p.m., in response to message #15 by Katie Wasserman Gene, I second Katie's request. Nashville is fine by me! Namir

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #17 Posted by gene wright on 2 Mar 2011, 2:10 p.m., in response to message #16 by Namir Nashville it won't be. We looked into it but the HHC committee settled on San Diego. Of course, anyone passing through Nashville should give me a shout. :-)

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #18 Posted by Namir on 2 Mar 2011, 4:46 p.m., in response to message #17 by gene wright Gene, I can do San Diego. I may spend a few days in the Phoenix area before or after the conference to visit my sister and maybe my son if he is accepted at AZ State University for a PhD program. I remember the last time we did San Diego, I only did Saturday (I stayed a few days in AZ before the conference), flew back Saturday night on a red eye to attend the wedding of one of my step sons. My wife thought I was not coming at all, but she underestimated geek fellowship. Our brotherhood is special!! yes sir!! Namir

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale - HHC 2011 Message #19 Posted by Andrés C. Rodríguez (Argentina) on 2 Mar 2011, 3:43 p.m., in response to message #14 by gene wright The choice of San Diego doubles my chance of attending, from 5% to 10%... :-) Let's dream for a while; season is as good (or bad) as others. No holidays in september here, but it's just a couple of days!

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale - HHC 2011 Message #20 Posted by Marcus von Cube, Germany on 3 Mar 2011, 6:44 a.m., in response to message #19 by Andrés C. Rodríguez (Argentina) Anywhere in the U.S. is (too?) far away from my point of view.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #21 Posted by Walter B on 28 Feb 2011, 3:03 p.m., in response to message #6 by Martin Pinckney Quote: Those who know don't speak [TW], and those who speak don't know [et. al.] I'm a bit confused about your second bracket. FYI, "et al." (only one dot!) means "et alii" = "also others" in Latin. So what do you want to tell us with that??

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #22 Posted by Martin Pinckney on 28 Feb 2011, 10:20 p.m., in response to message #21 by Walter B Walter, Quote: So what do you want to tell us with that? Only one knows "and [the] others" do not. OK, so I took a little license with the Latin. But not much.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #23 Posted by Walter B on 1 Mar 2011, 1:02 a.m., in response to message #22 by Martin Pinckney Martin, obviously you've attended more Creative Writing classes than Grammar. But be assured you're not alone :-/

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #24 Posted by Martin Pinckney on 1 Mar 2011, 11:01 a.m., in response to message #23 by Walter B No, the creativeness is my own. {:-)

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #25 Posted by Ángel Martin on 1 Mar 2011, 5:12 p.m., in response to message #24 by Martin Pinckney Quote: the creativeness is my own wasn't that creativity? I love english, such a versatile tongue :)!!

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #26 Posted by Mike Morrow on 2 Mar 2011, 11:22 a.m., in response to message #1 by Jeff Quote: It was couple of years ago that HP announced a new financial calculator and some ugly home office units. Not much has happened since. Are you familiar with the HP 30b? Last year's 30b is, IMO, one of the most exciting HP calculators to appear in a very long time. Sure, it's a "financial" calculator, but it has more scientific functions than earlier HP financial calculators and is ten times faster than the HP 50G. It has the best mechanical presentation (again, IMO) for a handheld unit since the Woodstocks. I have little use for financial functions, but the 30b is worth carrying even for purely scientific or engineering use. I do agree that HP seems to have over-played the financial calculator market sphere. Many here agree that a good "scientific" programable that breaks out of the 32SII/33S/35S paradigm of pure mediocrity would be most welcome.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #27 Posted by Marcus von Cube, Germany on 2 Mar 2011, 11:46 a.m., in response to message #26 by Mike Morrow You know there is some work on it going on? Not directly by HP but since the 20b/30b are open platforms, it's mostly a matter of software.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #28 Posted by Mike Morrow on 2 Mar 2011, 1:39 p.m., in response to message #27 by Marcus von Cube, Germany I praise the intellectual and technical challenge of "re-firmwaring" items like the 30b, but the hardware limitations of the associated ARM, especially its RAM and display control, make it impossible to make a very capable scientific programmable calculator from the 30b. Plus, maybe it's just me, but I would not want a scientific calculator whose keys are all labeled for financial functions.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #29 Posted by Martin Pinckney on 2 Mar 2011, 4:13 p.m., in response to message #28 by Mike Morrow Agreed, key labeling would be an issue for me.

Re: HP Line is Getting Kind of Stale Message #30 Posted by Walter B on 2 Mar 2011, 4:52 p.m., in response to message #28 by Mike Morrow Mike, Quote: I praise the intellectual and technical challenge of "re-firmwaring" items like the 30b, but the hardware limitations of the associated ARM, especially its RAM and display control, make it impossible to make a very capable scientific programmable calculator from the 30b. We all know - and it was discussed here at length - the display of the 20/30b being far from what we'd wish, but that's the hardware we've got. Though I agree on your statement, we are working on making at least a capable scientific programmable RPN calculator from the 30b. If and when we succeed doing so, I'll lean back for some hours and will watch what else will come d:-) Quote: ... I would not want a scientific calculator whose keys are all labeled for financial functions. Nor do I - and we'll find a solution.

34s challenge... Message #31 Posted by gene wright on 2 Mar 2011, 5:42 p.m., in response to message #30 by Walter B Walter, et al. How about setting a challenge date of the HHC 2011 conference in late september to get this running on real hardware? Be a great push and celebration to go along with many other great things happening this year... the 41CL, the update to the MLDL, etc. I could try to come up with a prize to the member of the 34s team who makes it happen who happens to be at HHC 2011!

Re: 34s challenge... Message #32 Posted by Walter B on 3 Mar 2011, 9:22 a.m., in response to message #31 by gene wright Gene, very nice idea :-) but IMHO you did neglect two points: The progress in this matter is not determined by a lack of motivation but by the lack of appropriate resources. This crucial point was mentioned here and on last HHC more than once. Almost any prize I can imagine will not cover the travel expenses one of us will need going to San Diego (very nice city, BTW) just for the HHC. Please remember also this is a project we pursue in our spare time. All this is well known (or could be at least by mere reading and a tiny bit of thinking). Seems, however, there's a big gap between wishing good luck and doing something helpful in a sustainable way. Luckily, we have succeeded gaining another temporary freelancer (increasing our headcount by 50%) recently, willing to help and contributing the necessary expertise. There's a good chance for progress in this matter now - may there be a prize or not. As soon as we have a wp34s prototype and we may need some marketing support, we'll most probably turn to the international experts in this matter - we know where the best marketeers live ;-) Disclaimer (necessary as I know the audience): The above is just my humble opinion based on my individual experience so far. No personal offense intended. And of course only the German original text is binding ;-)

Re: 34s challenge... Message #33 Posted by Scott Newell on 3 Mar 2011, 11:31 a.m., in response to message #32 by Walter B Quote: Gene, very nice idea :-) but IMHO you did neglect two points: The progress in this matter is not determined by a lack of motivation but by the lack of appropriate resources. This crucial point was mentioned here and on last HHC more than once. My lack of progress on the 20B and 12C hacking is not due to toolchain and/or hardware issues. It's more a matter of being lazy. (Well, newlib's monster sprintf() isn't encouraging, either...)

Re: 34s challenge... Message #34 Posted by Paul Dale on 4 Mar 2011, 1:05 a.m., in response to message #33 by Scott Newell Quote: Well, newlib's monster sprintf() isn't encouraging, either... There are smaller options available. Grab uClibc, it has a fairly complete but small implementation. uClinux includes an even small version in lib/libc from memory. There are others.... - Pauli Edited: 4 Mar 2011, 1:06 a.m.

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